Terry McGuire is an award-winning journalist and news anchor turned mental health and hope advocate. The Giving Voice to Depression podcast that she created and cohosts has been downloaded more than 2.5 million times, and ranks in the top 1% of global podcasts.
The Giving Voice to Mental Health Podcast recently shared a deeply personal story of resilience with Maureen, who recounted her journey through an eating disorder that began during her time as a ballet dancer in the 1980s. Her powerful narrative offers crucial understanding and hope for individuals facing similar challenges and those who support them. Hosts Terry McGuire and Caroline Beidler guided a conversation that illuminated the isolation of struggling with an eating disorder when awareness was limited, contrasting it with the growing resources available today.
More Than Just Food: Understanding the Core of Recovery
Maureen thoughtfully described her experience not as a “battle,” but as “working through” an eating disorder. This highlights the ongoing and internal nature of recovery, extending beyond just physical health to encompass self-image, self-esteem, and, most importantly, self-love.
“I feel that I am recovering from a combination of… not understanding how to take care of myself. It’s beyond the amount of food that you put in your body, for example, it’s really about self-image and self-esteem and self-love…”
Her words emphasize that true recovery involves a fundamental shift in how one perceives and values themselves.
The Weight of External Expectations: Body Image and Triggers
As a ballet dancer in the 1980s, Maureen faced immense pressure regarding her body image. This environment became a significant trigger, highlighting how external expectations can contribute to the development of eating disorders.
“As a young person in college, I was a dancer, a ballet dancer in the 1980s and at that time, body image was a huge thing and you had to look a certain way and be a certain way in order to perform…”
This experience underscores the importance of recognizing and addressing societal and environmental factors that can fuel disordered eating.
A Long and Winding Road: The Reality of Ongoing Recovery
Maureen’s journey to self-acceptance has spanned decades, illustrating that recovery is rarely a straight path. It involves continuous effort, with challenges and negative thoughts potentially resurfacing.
“It’s taken me this much of my life to arrive at being okay with myself, you know? And even that gets challenged all the time… I’m always in recovery. I’m always working on recovery.”
Her strength lies in her ability to identify unhealthy patterns and consciously choose a healthier direction, affirming, “You’re okay. You’re good just the way you are.”
The Harmful Words: What Not to Say to Someone Struggling
Well-intentioned but misguided advice, such as “just eat more,” can be detrimental to someone with an eating disorder. Maureen emphasized the importance of avoiding comments about food altogether.
“Teachers didn’t really know what to do with me. They didn’t know what to say. They just kept saying, well, you have to eat more. You have to eat more. It’s not what, it’s not the right thing to say… Don’t say anything about food. Leave it alone and let me figure it out.”
Instead, she suggests expressing non-judgmental support and focusing on aspects of their life unrelated to food or body image. Suggesting alternative activities, like “Let’s go for a walk,” can be far more helpful.
Finding Support: The Power of Connection
While formal therapy wasn’t consistently available to Maureen in the early stages, she found crucial support in friends, particularly within the modern dance community, which offered a more accepting environment. This highlights the significance of supportive relationships in recovery.
“I found support in friends and interestingly in among dancer friends… I found a really wonderful, supportive community there.”
The lack of readily available professional help in the 1980s underscores the progress made in providing resources today.
A World of Options: Hope for Today and Tomorrow
Maureen reflected on the lack of treatment options available when she was struggling, a stark contrast to the resources that exist now. Today, individuals have access to information, various therapies, peer support groups, and treatment facilities.
“If it happened to me now, I wouldn’t hesitate to look around for a place to go, you know, somebody to talk to or a situation to take care of myself…”
Caroline emphasized the wealth of information available on https://recovery.com/resources/ and the importance of educating ourselves and others about eating disorders and available support.
Embracing Life: Finding Joy in Self-Acceptance
Maureen’s journey ultimately led her to a powerful realization: life is truly good when you treat yourself with kindness and embrace self-acceptance.
“Oh. ’cause life is so good when you’re, when you’re able to treat yourself well. When you’re able to love yourself and accept yourself, life is really, really great.”
This message of hope and the possibility of a more positive and vibrant life serves as an encouragement for anyone currently struggling to believe in their own potential for recovery and self-love.
This article summarizes a heartfelt conversation from the Giving Voice to Depression podcast, hosted by Terry McGuire. In Episode 357, “The Power of Yet: Reclaiming Hope,” Terry and co-host Dr. Anita Sanz revisit Lori’s deeply personal journey through persistent depression. With remarkable honesty, Lori shares the painful truths, small victories, and gentle shifts that helped her reclaim a sense of hope after nearly a decade of feeling stuck.
This article isn’t about “quick fixes” or magic solutions. It’s about the power of small steps, the importance of connection, and the courage it takes to remain open to the possibility of change—even when hope feels out of reach. Whether you are navigating depression yourself or walking alongside someone who is, these insights offer gentle reminders that healing is possible—even if you haven’t found the right path yet.
1. Understand That You Are Not Broken, You Are Stuck
The most profound realization Lori took away from her treatment experience was one that challenged the very foundation of how she saw herself:
Lori: You don’t need to be fixed because you’re not broken. You’re just stuck.
Those words softened years of self-blame. Because broken feels permanent. It suggests damage that cannot be undone. But stuck? Stuck means there’s still a way forward. Maybe not easily, maybe not quickly—but forward nonetheless.
Why this matters:
Stuck means temporary. Broken feels hopeless.
Stuck suggests there is a way through. Broken suggests there is not.
Stuck invites compassion. Broken fuels shame.
If you are struggling, please hear this: You are not broken. You are not beyond help. You are stuck—and stuck is something that can change.
2. Know That You Are Not Alone
For so many people living with chronic depression, one of the heaviest burdens is the belief that they are the only one who feels this way. Lori expressed this beautifully when she said:
Lori: I didn’t know anybody at all like me that just lived with that all-the-time depression.
That sense of isolation can deepen despair and reinforce the lie that something is uniquely wrong with you. But Lori’s experience at the treatment center introduced her to others who shared similar struggles. It was life-changing.
Lori: It maybe just took a little bit of the burden off of me just thinking that it was just me.
Ways to remind yourself you’re not alone:
Join a peer support group
Listen to stories like Lori’s and others on Giving Voice to Depression
Seek community through online mental health forums
Connection breaks isolation. It chips away at the lie that you are the only one.
3. Make Small, Consistent Shifts
One of the most powerful lessons Lori learned was the importance of small, manageable changes—what she calls “tiny shifts.”
Lori: They said, what if you’re willing to shift your thinking like one degree? Not 180 degrees—one degree.
It can be tempting to believe that healing requires radical transformation. But often, it’s the small, consistent adjustments that move us toward a better place.
Think of an airplane changing course by just one degree. Over time, that tiny shift leads to an entirely different destination. It’s the same with depression recovery.
Gentle suggestions:
Try one new coping tool
Adjust your inner self-talk by just one phrase
Commit to one small act of self-care each day
You don’t have to overhaul your life. You just have to be willing to try something different—even one degree different.
4. Embrace the Power of “Yet”
Throughout the episode, Terry and Dr. Anita reflect on the significance of one small word: yet. It’s a word that keeps the door to possibility cracked open, even when hope feels impossible.
Instead of saying:
“I’m not better.”
Try saying:
“I’m not better yet.”
“I haven’t found what helps yet.”
“Yet” acknowledges the reality of where you are without closing the door on where you could go. It’s an invitation to remain open to the possibility of change—even if that change hasn’t arrived today.
5. Recognize Depression’s Lies
Depression is more than sadness. It’s a master manipulator—a voice that whispers cruel, believable lies about your worth and your future.
Lori: I always wanted somebody to fix me. I’m like, why can’t somebody fix me? Why can’t meds fix me, why can’t a counselor? Why can’t I be fixed? And they said, you don’t need to be fixed because you’re not broken. You’re just stuck.
Depression lies when it tells you:
“You are worthless.”
“You will always feel this way.”
“Nothing will ever help.”
As Terry gently reminds listeners:
Terry: Of course, every message you’re getting is ‘Nothing will change and you’re not worth it,’ but that’s the lie.
To counter these lies:
Speak your truth out loud
Challenge the negative thoughts, even when they feel convincing
Surround yourself with people who remind you of your value
6. Honor Your Past Without Letting It Define You
Lori shared how easy it was to live in the story of her past—believing that the failures and pain behind her were proof that nothing could change.
But one small shift in thinking changed everything:
Lori: Your past is very important… but now what? How do you get through the rest of your life?
Acknowledging where you’ve been is vital. But staying stuck there keeps you from moving forward. Healing invites us to carry the lessons, not the weight.
Ways to let go of the past’s grip:
Mindfulness practices that anchor you in the present
Forgiveness work (especially self-forgiveness)
Compassionate self-reflection instead of harsh judgment
7. Lighten Your Load: From Backpack Person to Screen Door Person
One of the most memorable metaphors Lori shares is the idea of being a “backpack person” versus a “screen door person.”
Lori: I was a huge backpack person. Everything that happened to me—and to others—I put it in my backpack and carried it. It just got so heavy.
When we carry every hurt, every disappointment, and every responsibility like stones in a backpack, the load becomes unbearable. Lori learned to let go of that weight, choosing instead to let life’s experiences “blow through” like air through a screen door:
Lori: I don’t need to cling to it. I don’t need to judge it. I don’t need to carry it.
Visualize this:
Notice what you’re packing into your backpack
Ask yourself what you can let go of today
Picture yourself as a screen door—allowing life to flow through without trapping it inside
8. Redefine Your Worth: You Don’t Have to Earn It
A major shift for Lori came when she realized how much of her pain was tied to contingent self-worth—the belief that her value had to be earned through success, perfection, or selflessness.
But in treatment, she heard a truth that helped her begin to break free from that cycle:
Lori: My worth is a set point. It’s not changeable.
Your worth is not up for debate. It is not based on your productivity, your weight, your income, or how many people you please. It is inherent. It is constant. It is yours.
Daily reminders:
“I am worthy as I am.”
“My worth does not fluctuate.”
“I do not have to earn the right to take up space.”
9. Stay Open-Minded About What Might Help
Lori’s healing journey didn’t look like what she expected. In fact, some of the tools that made a difference were things she might have dismissed before.
As Terry observed:
Terry: There may be gourd painting, and it’d be real easy to be like, ‘Oh, hell no.’ But the act of doing that shifted something.
The truth is, we never know what might open a door, spark a shift, or offer relief. Sometimes, what seems silly or “not for me” turns out to be the thing that helps the most.
Stay open to:
Creative outlets
Mindfulness exercises
Group experiences you’ve never tried before
Remember Anita’s words of wisdom: “Never say never.”
10. Trust That Slow Progress Is Still Progress
Healing is not linear. There are no straight lines in this journey, and there is no timeline you “should” be on.
Lori: It took a lot of years—my whole lifetime—to get to where I was. I can’t just spin on a dime and everything’s different now.
But even with that reality, Lori noticed something beautiful: the dread that once met her every morning had begun to soften.
Lori: I don’t go to bed at night fearing having to wake up the next morning. I don’t wake up feeling severely disappointed because I wish I hadn’t. I’m slowly doing better, and I’m not in any rush to get better or be happy—but I’m noticing more contentment in my days. And that’s enough for now.
Let this be your encouragement:
Slow is okay
Small is meaningful
“Enough for now” is still enough
Final Thoughts: You Are Worthy of Hope and Healing
Lori’s story is a powerful reminder that even when depression feels like it has stripped away every ounce of hope, there are still paths forward—even if they are small, even if they are slow, even if you haven’t found them yet.
Terry: Depression is too dark a road to walk alone.
Please remember: you are not alone. You are not broken. You are worthy of support, compassion, and hope.
Healing may not happen overnight. But with each small step, each gentle shift, and each courageous act of staying open to the possibility of something new, you are moving forward.
And sometimes, that’s the bravest thing we can do.
This article summarizes a deeply personal conversation featured on the Giving Voice to Depression podcast, hosted by Terry McGuire. In each episode, Terry speaks with someone who has lived experience of depression or a mental health professional working in the field. In Episode 356: “Living at 60%: A Raw Look at Persistent Depression” guest Lori shares her story of living with persistent depressive disorder (PDD), offering honest insight into what it’s like to survive—not thrive—on a daily basis.
Unlike the more episodic nature of major depressive disorder, PDD is a chronic, long-lasting form of depression, often described as living life through a heavy, emotional fog. Lori’s reflections are raw and real, shedding light on the misunderstood experience of “high-functioning” depression. Below are the key takeaways and hard truths Lori reveals about this condition.
1. Persistent Depression Is Not Just “Sadness” That Won’t Go Away
PDD isn’t about feeling low occasionally—it’s about feeling low always. Lori has lived in a nearly constant state of depression for nine years, with the occasional major depressive episode layered on top. This overlapping experience is sometimes called “double depression.”
“I’m not, you know, laid out flat where I just can’t function. But it feels like that’s kind of where I stopped, but I’ve never truly regained the emotional feelings of what it feels like to be out in the sunshine like normal.” – Lori
2. People With PDD Can Still Function—But It Comes at a High Cost
Lori explains she operates at about 60% of her capacity most days. To outsiders, she may appear functional, but internally, every task requires immense effort.
She finds herself completely drained, whether or not she worked that day.
Even pleasant activities are exhausting.
Smiling or participating in joyful moments feels performative, not genuine.
“I can do things…but it’s still really hard and I just have to push myself to keep going because I have to. I mean, I don’t have a choice.” – Lori
3. Starting at 60% Means You’re Already Close to the Bottom
Living at 60% makes you more vulnerable to the lows. A minor setback can plunge someone dangerously close to the pit of depression. This constant proximity to the edge is one of the most harrowing realities of PDD.
“It’s scary because you’re closer to the bottom… So just maybe sometimes even a little swing can make a dramatic difference in how much I’m able to function because it’s like starting out underwater.” – Lori
4. Joy Feels Muffled—Like You’re Underwater
In one of the most powerful metaphors of the episode, Lori likens her experience of depression to listening to music underwater. You know the song is beautiful, but you can’t really hear it.
“So like, say I’m doing something with my kids … I can know that I should be feeling joyful about it, like this is a joyous occasion. I know what it should be. I just can’t get there” – Lori
5. Morning Is the Hardest Part of the Day
For Lori, every morning begins with despair. It’s not about needing more sleep. It’s about not having the will to face another day of heavy emotional labor.
“Every single morning I wake up and I’m really disappointed that I woke up again… it feels like I have a beanbag chair full of lead on top of me. It’s like, I’m awake and I can’t … I can’t do anything.” – Lori
6. Passive Suicidal Ideation Is Real and Misunderstood
Lori’s experience includes passive suicidal ideation—not active planning, but a consistent, draining wish to “just not wake up.” This type of ideation is often overlooked or minimized.
It’s not a desire to die.
It’s a desire for the pain to stop.
It’s a yearning for rest from a relentless internal struggle.
7. Depression Isn’t Always Visible—Or Obvious
Lori’s story reinforces how well people with chronic depression can mask their struggles. To outsiders, they may appear fine—cheerful, even productive. But appearances can be deceiving.
“You fake it well enough that someone who doesn’t know you wouldn’t know.” – Terry McGuire, describing the hard-to-see nature of Lori’s depression
8. Well-Meaning Advice Can Do More Harm Than Good
Friends and loved ones often try to help, but the impulse to fix or minimize the issue often backfires. Common phrases like:
“Still?! I thought you were better.”
“Well, you look fine.”
“Maybe try adjusting your meds again.”
…can feel dismissive, invalidating the chronic nature of the illness.
“So to try to fix things is just really, really hard to have people suggest … If there was anything, anything that I could do, you know I would do it.” – Lori
9. Support Is About Validation, Not Fixing
The best support isn’t about solutions—it’s about acknowledging the struggle. Lori stresses how powerful it is when someone simply recognizes her effort to stay afloat.
Say: “That sounds so hard. Props to you for showing up anyway.”
Avoid: “Have you tried XYZ?”
10. Hope Can Feel Impossible—But Curiosity Might Be Enough
Telling someone with chronic depression to “stay hopeful” can feel cruel. But offering them the idea of staying curious can be more accessible and effective.
“Years ago a guest said, you don’t have to be hopeful about your future, but try to be at least a little curious—and that can be enough.” – Terry McGuire
11. Persistent Depression Deserves Its Own Diagnosis and Compassion
Dr. Anita Sanz, the podcast’s former co-host and a psychologist, emphasizes that persistent depressive disorder is not a failure of treatment or effort. It’s a legitimate, chronic mental illness that demands acknowledgment and compassion.
It’s not caused by a failure to try hard enough.
It’s not due to ineffective therapy or medication alone.
It’s its own category, deserving of understanding and patience.
“It is not milder in the sense of the impact on the person… because it can just literally feel like you’re being worn down.” – Dr. Anita Sanz
12. Even Enjoyable Activities Can Be Exhausting
Socializing, hobbies, or special occasions may seem like a break from depression—but for someone with PDD, even positive interactions can feel like another task.
Lori often agrees to activities for her own good.
But when the time comes, she regrets committing.
The guilt and self-judgment compound the emotional load.
13. Change Is Possible—But It May Be Subtle
While Lori’s condition didn’t disappear, she did attend a treatment program that made a noticeable shift. She now no longer dreads waking up, even if mornings are still difficult.
The change was subtle—but significant.
It proves that things can shift, even if healing doesn’t look like a complete recovery.
“[Lori] will tell us she no longer goes to bed dreading waking. And when she wakes, while it’s still difficult physically and mentally to get up and get the day started, it’s not because she wishes she hadn’t waken. [Her treatment] did effect a shift.” – Terry
+1: Just Stay—Even If It’s Just One Day at a Time
A central takeaway from Lori’s story and Terry and Anita’s reflections is that sometimes staying alive and continuing to show up is the hardest and most courageous thing a person can do. It might not get better right away—but staying alive means you’re here if it does.
Focus on just getting through today.
Be kind to yourself in the hardest moments.
Understand that managing chronic depression is a full-time job.
“The most important thing is to stay so that you’re here to see the shift. And that’s what we always come back to is, please stay, that’s the most important thing. And then the next most important thing is, let’s not make staying be so miserable because that’s not okay either. I don’t want you to stay and be miserable. I want you stay and have life be actually something worth feeling like it’s worth living. And so then we go from there.” – Dr. Sanz
Final Thoughts
Living with persistent depressive disorder (PDD) isn’t about surviving a rough patch—it’s about enduring a constant emotional weight that never fully lifts. As Lori shares in her courageous and unfiltered interview, the experience isn’t defined by dramatic breakdowns or total dysfunction, but rather by the exhausting, relentless effort it takes to maintain a semblance of normalcy while feeling internally disconnected from joy, motivation, and hope.
This kind of depression can be deeply isolating. When the world expects smiles, productivity, and gratitude, living at 60% feels like you’re failing to meet invisible standards—standards that don’t apply to a chronic mental health condition. Lori’s honesty gives voice to an experience that many silently endure: waking up disappointed to still be here, pushing through the day without access to joy, and feeling invisible because you “look fine.”
But her story also reminds us that even subtle shifts—like no longer dreading the morning—are worth acknowledging and celebrating. While recovery might not mean a return to 100%, it can mean finding better tools, support, and moments of relief.
The most important takeaway? We need to believe people when they say they’re struggling, and support them in ways that emphasize presence, compassion, and endurance—not quick fixes or false optimism.
Evelyn’s recent heartfelt conversation on the Giving Voice to Mental Health Podcast, hosted by Recovery.com, offers a beacon of hope and practical wisdom for anyone navigating the complexities of mental health recovery.
Her personal journey underscores a fundamental truth: recovery is not a passive event but an active, ongoing choice deeply intertwined with recognizing one’s inherent worthiness. In her own words, “Recovery is a choice every day that you have to choose to do… and it truly is something everyone deserves.”
Recovery Beyond Diagnosis: Healing the Belief of Unworthiness
Evelyn’s perspective on recovery moves beyond simply addressing diagnostic labels like OCD and anxiety. Instead, she emphasizes the crucial work of healing the often underlying and deeply ingrained belief of unworthiness. “I’m just recovering from not feeling worthy… recovering from the belief that I did not deserve to be happy,” she shared.
This reframing highlights the importance of tackling the core emotional wounds that can fuel mental health challenges. True recovery, in this light, involves recognizing and embracing your fundamental right to happiness and well-being, irrespective of any mental health diagnosis you may have received.
The Crucial First Step: Recognizing the Need and Seeking Help
Evelyn powerfully stresses that seeking help for mental health challenges should never be viewed as a last resort, reserved only for times of absolute crisis. “I don’t want you to think that you have to be a certain amount of sick in order to get treatment because I don’t think that’s true.”
Early intervention is paramount and can significantly improve the trajectory of recovery. Exploring available resources, such as those found on Recovery.com, is a vital first step. Reaching out for support is not a sign of weakness but rather a courageous act of self-awareness and a powerful commitment to your well-being.
What works for one individual may not resonate with another, making the search for the right support and treatment essential. An individual approach can encompass various forms of therapy, medication, peer support groups, lifestyle adjustments, or an integrated approach. Exploring different options and feeling empowered to advocate for your specific requirements are crucial steps in discovering what truly facilitates your healing and growth.
Cultivating Empathy Through Personal Struggles
While acknowledging the significant difficulties posed by OCD and anxiety, Evelyn also discovered an unexpected and profound outcome: a heightened capacity for empathy. “I do think that they provided me with such wonderful insight on the amount of struggle… I think it gifted me with empathy and gifted me with compassion.”
This insight underscores the potential for personal growth and a deeper connection with the shared human experience, even amidst challenging circumstances. It reminds us that navigating adversity can cultivate a greater understanding and compassion for others facing their own battles.
Breaking Down Barriers: Challenging the Stigma of Mental Health Support
Evelyn’s narrative serves as a powerful challenge to the pervasive stigma surrounding mental health support. “Why do you have to do it alone? Asking for help is not a bad thing… you deserve to feel better.” Seeking assistance when you are struggling is not a sign of failure but rather an act of profound self-care and self-respect. There is no shame in needing support, and connecting with mental health professionals, support groups, and loved ones can create a stronger, more resilient path toward recovery.
Remember, you are inherently worthy of feeling well, and accessing available resources is a testament to that worth.
Giving Voice to Mental Health shares real stories from individuals at different stages of their mental health journeys, providing inspiration, understanding, and support. It’s a space where personal experiences with mental health challenges are voiced to highlight the ups and downs of healing, benefiting individuals, families, and communities.
Giving Voice to Addiction shares the powerful and often unheard stories of real people navigating addiction, hosted by Terry McGuire and expert co-host Caroline Beidler. Listen each week for raw accounts of struggle, resilience, and hope in recovery, offering connection, understanding, and inspiration for anyone seeking to learn or feel less alone.
This in-depth exploration is inspired by the Giving Voice to Depression podcast, hosted by Terry McGuire. The podcast serves as a platform to foster open conversations about mental health, recognizing the importance of addressing conditions like depression with clarity and empathy. In this episode, a critical yet often misunderstood topic takes center stage: the distinction between sadness and clinical depression.
The ability to differentiate between these two states is paramount. Misunderstanding can lead to the dismissal of a serious mental health condition, preventing individuals from seeking the help they need. Conversely, it can also result in unnecessary alarm and overreaction to transient emotional experiences that are a normal part of life.
To navigate this complex terrain, the podcast features insights from respected experts in the field: Dr. Robert Duff, Dr. Margaret Rutherford, and Dr. Maduka Trivedi, each offering valuable perspectives rooted in their clinical experience and research.
1. Defining Depression: Beyond the Common Usage
Dr. Robert Duff, a psychologist, begins by dissecting the common understanding of “depression.” In everyday language, the term is frequently used to describe a temporary state of feeling down, discouraged, or simply “blue.” These feelings are a natural part of the human experience and can be triggered by various life events, from minor disappointments to significant losses. However, Dr. Duff emphasizes the crucial distinction between this transient sadness and clinical depression.
Clinical depression, he explains, is characterized by a persistent pattern of these negative feelings. It’s not just a fleeting moment of sadness but a prolonged state that can encompass a range of emotional, physical, and cognitive symptoms. These symptoms can include persistent sadness, loss of interest or pleasure in activities, changes in appetite or sleep, fatigue, feelings of worthlessness, difficulty concentrating, and even thoughts of death or suicide. The key differentiator lies in the duration, intensity, and pervasive nature of these symptoms, and the degree to which they significantly interfere with an individual’s daily life and overall functioning.
“You can feel depressed without being depressed, right?
Without being clinically depressed.
Depression is a feeling that everybody has of being sad, of feeling like the wind’s taken out of your sails, maybe being lethargic, things like that.
But with clinical depression, it’s a pattern of those feelings.”
2. Depression as a Real and Tangible Illness
One of the most important messages conveyed in the podcast is that clinical depression is a real and diagnosable mental illness. It’s not simply a matter of lacking willpower, being overly sensitive, or failing to “snap out of it.” Dr. Duff firmly states that there are actual physiological differences in the brain of a person experiencing depression.
Research has shown that depression is associated with changes in neurotransmitter activity, brain structure, and hormonal function. These biological factors contribute to the symptoms of depression and explain why treatments such as medication and psychotherapy can be effective. The podcast emphasizes that recognizing depression as a legitimate illness is crucial for reducing stigma and encouraging individuals to seek help without shame or self-blame.
3. The Insidious Nature of Depression: A Parasitic Force
Dr. Duff offers a powerful analogy to illustrate the insidious nature of depression, comparing it to a parasite. He explains that depression has a way of draining an individual’s energy, perpetuating a cycle of guilt and negativity, and distorting their self-perception.
Depression often leads to lethargy and a lack of motivation, making it difficult to engage in activities that typically bring joy or a sense of accomplishment. This inactivity can then lead to feelings of guilt and worthlessness, further deepening the depression. Moreover, depression can warp a person’s thoughts, causing them to develop negative beliefs about themselves, their abilities, and their future. This “cognitive distortion” is a hallmark of depression, and it can be incredibly challenging to overcome without intervention.
“I like to think of depression kind of as a parasite because it does all of the things to you that it needs to keep itself strong.
It saps your energy, so it makes you feel more lethargic, which makes you not do things, which makes you feel more guilty, which make you feel more depressed, and so it goes in a cycle and it builds itself up and up.”
4. Triggers and Duration: Key Distinguishing Factors
Dr. Margaret Rutherford, another experienced psychologist, highlights the importance of considering triggers and duration when differentiating between sadness and depression.
Sadness is often a direct response to a specific event or situation. It might be triggered by a disappointment, a loss, a conflict, or a challenging life transition. While sadness can be intense and painful, it tends to be time-limited. The intensity of the emotion gradually subsides, and the individual is able to return to their normal level of functioning.
In contrast, depression can sometimes arise without an identifiable external trigger. While it can certainly be precipitated by a traumatic event or significant loss, it can also develop gradually or seemingly out of the blue. Furthermore, depression is characterized by its persistence. The feelings of sadness, hopelessness, and despair linger for weeks, months, or even years, significantly impacting the individual’s ability to function in daily life.
5. The All-Encompassing Impact of Depression
Depression is not confined to just one aspect of an individual’s experience; it can be all-encompassing, affecting their emotional state, physical health, thoughts, and behaviors.
Bridget, the podcast’s co-host, uses the word “consumed” to describe the feeling of being overwhelmed by depression. Dr. Rutherford adds that it can feel as though one “forget[s] how to be happy.” This highlights a crucial aspect of depression: it can significantly impair an individual’s capacity to experience positive emotions. It’s not that the desire for happiness is absent, but rather that the brain’s ability to process and generate those feelings is compromised.
6. Depression Is Not a Choice: Dispelling Misconceptions
A common misconception about depression is that it’s a matter of choice, that individuals could simply “choose” to be happier if they wanted to. The podcast strongly refutes this notion.
Dr. Rutherford emphasizes that people with depression are not “whiners” or simply feeling sorry for themselves. Depression is a distinct “state of mind” characterized by changes in brain function that affect mood regulation, motivation, and cognitive processes. The inability to experience joy or find pleasure in activities is a core symptom of depression, and it’s not something that can be overcome through sheer willpower.
“People with depression are not whiners.
They’re not just feeling sorry for themselves. It is a state of mind.
It’s as if you can’t focus on whatever you had in your life that you enjoyed, you no longer enjoy it, and that’s not a choice.
That’s the reality of how you feel.”
7. The Role of Genetics in Depression
The podcast also touches on the role of genetics in depression. Dr. Rutherford explains that there is often a “genetic predisposition” for depression.
Just as individuals can inherit a predisposition for other medical conditions, such as diabetes or cancer, they can also inherit a vulnerability to depression. This means that if a person has a family history of depression, they may be at an increased risk of developing the illness themselves. It’s important to note that having a genetic predisposition does not guarantee that someone will develop depression, but it can make them more susceptible.
8. Depression as a Cloud: A Distorted Perspective
Dr. Maduka Trivedi, head of the Center for Depression Research and Clinical Care at UT Southwestern Medical Center, offers a powerful metaphor to describe the impact of depression on an individual’s perception. He likens depression to a “cloud hanging over your head.”
This cloud distorts thoughts, feelings, and experiences, casting a negative filter over everything. Even in the presence of positive events or experiences, the cloud of depression can make it difficult to feel joy or find relief from negative thoughts. Dr. Trivedi contrasts this with normal sadness, where positive events can provide temporary respite from negative feelings. In depression, however, the negative thoughts and feelings are pervasive and unrelenting.
“So I think in general the way I explain to lay people is the following: all of us can have ups and downs in life and when you have a down period you do feel down but there are two easy signals that we tell you.
One is even when you are feeling down if there is some positive thing happening in your life or some positive event occurring or somebody … a loved one calls you, you temporarily or even sometimes immediately get out of that funk and start sort of communicating like you were before.
If you have a small-d depression … a sort of bad day.
If you have Depression it is very hard to do that because your ruminative negative thoughts just overtake no matter what the environment is.”
9. The Importance of Acknowledging Depression as a Real Illness
Dr. Trivedi emphasizes the critical importance of acknowledging depression as a real illness. He stresses that it is a “brain disease” with distinct and identifiable signs and symptoms.
Dismissing depression as “just feeling sad” or telling people to “get over it” is not only insensitive but also harmful. It invalidates the individual’s experience and discourages them from seeking the help they need. Dr. Trivedi asserts that depression is not a “weakness” or a character flaw. It is a medical condition that requires understanding, compassion, and appropriate treatment.
10. Key Symptoms of Depression: A Comprehensive Overview
The podcast references a list of key symptoms of depression, drawing from resources like WebMD. These symptoms provide a more detailed understanding of the multifaceted nature of depression:
Depressed mood: This involves persistent feelings of sadness, emptiness, or hopelessness. It’s more than just a passing feeling of sadness; it’s a pervasive and enduring state.
Loss of interest or pleasure: One of the hallmark symptoms of depression is a significant decrease in interest or pleasure in activities that were once enjoyable. This can affect hobbies, social activities, work, and even relationships.
Significant weight changes: Depression can lead to changes in appetite, resulting in significant weight loss when not dieting or significant weight gain.
Sleep disturbances: Depression can disrupt sleep patterns, causing insomnia (difficulty sleeping) or hypersomnia (excessive sleeping).
Restlessness or slowed movements: Some individuals with depression experience psychomotor agitation, characterized by restlessness or irritability. Others may experience psychomotor retardation, a slowing down of physical movements and speech.
Fatigue or loss of energy: Persistent fatigue and a lack of energy are common symptoms of depression.
In conclusion, this exploration, deeply rooted in the insights of the Giving Voice to Depression podcast, underscores the vital importance of distinguishing between transient sadness and the pervasive condition of clinical depression. Depression is not simply an amplified version of sadness but a distinct and serious illness that can profoundly impact every facet of an individual’s life.
By recognizing the key differences in triggers, duration, intensity, and the presence of accompanying symptoms, we can move towards a greater understanding of mental health and foster a more supportive environment for those who are struggling. If you or someone you know is experiencing symptoms of depression, seeking professional help is a critical step towards recovery and well-being.
The journey to overcoming alcohol addiction is rarely linear; it’s a complex path marked by personal battles, moments of clarity, and the ongoing pursuit of a healthier life. In the “Giving Voice to Addiction” podcast, Robert’s compelling narrative offers a deeply personal look into this struggle and the resilience required to achieve lasting recovery. His story is a powerful reminder that while the road may be arduous, it is ultimately navigable, and a fulfilling life free from alcohol’s grip is attainable.
1. The Allure of the First Drink
Robert’s introduction to alcohol occurred at 21, a moment etched in his memory. His first taste of a brandy Manhattan brought an unfamiliar sense of ease, a temporary escape from the anxieties that had begun to surface in his life.
“I remember the first time I took a drink and went, Oh, this, this is what I needed,”
This initial experience is a common thread in many addiction stories; alcohol often presents itself as a solution, a quick fix for deeper emotional or psychological discomfort. In Robert’s case, it offered a perceived antidote to the growing anxieties that clouded his mind.
Robert described the environment he grew up in as “a very anxious household where there was a lot of worry and a lot of concern over things that really didn’t matter.” As he matured and faced increased responsibilities, these anxious thoughts intensified. The temporary relief provided by alcohol created a dangerous association, setting the stage for a reliance that would soon spiral out of control.
2. The Insidious Progression
What began as an occasional indulgence gradually evolved into a habitual necessity. Robert initially confined his drinking to the privacy of his home, consuming beers and avoiding public settings like bars. However, this pattern slowly intensified, with the frequency and quantity of alcohol intake increasing over time.
The shift from casual use to dependence is often subtle. The comforting effect of alcohol, initially experienced as a welcome respite, creates a psychological craving. Over time, the body adapts to the presence of alcohol, leading to physical dependence. This dual mechanism makes it incredibly difficult to break free.
Robert’s narrative captures this insidious progression. The initial “Oh, this is what I need” sensation morphed into an inescapable “I have to have this to survive.” This transition marks a critical turning point where the individual loses control, and alcohol becomes the central focus of their existence.
3. The Moment of Reckoning
Despite the growing dependence, there often comes a moment of stark realization, a point where the individual acknowledges the destructive path they are on. For Robert, this moment arrived with a chilling certainty:
“This is going to be a problem,”
This recognition, however, does not always translate into immediate action. The grip of addiction is powerful, and the prospect of facing life without alcohol can be daunting. Individuals may attempt to regain control through measures like cutting back, but these efforts often prove futile in the long run.
In Robert’s case, a period of approximately six to seven years elapsed between this realization and the catalyst that finally propelled him toward seeking help. This highlights a critical aspect of addiction: the significant gap between recognizing the problem and taking concrete steps toward recovery.
4. The Impact of Life Events
Life events, both positive and negative, can significantly influence the trajectory of addiction. In Robert’s story, a divorce and subsequent relocation played a crucial role in escalating his drinking.
Divorce is an inherently stressful experience, often accompanied by feelings of loss, guilt, and uncertainty. Relocation can lead to isolation and a disruption of established support systems. In Robert’s case, these combined factors created a fertile ground for increased alcohol consumption as a means of coping with emotional pain and loneliness.
“I was lonesome. I miss my family. Wasn’t sure I’d made the right choice,”
This period of isolation and emotional turmoil further entrenched his reliance on alcohol, highlighting the interplay between life circumstances and the progression of addiction.
5. The Intervention: A Call to Action
Often, it takes an external catalyst to break through the denial and inertia of addiction. In Robert’s case, this catalyst came in the form of a direct confrontation from his employer.
“Bob, we think you have a drinking problem. We want to support you. We want to help you in any way we can, but you need to go get some help and you need to get sober and clean before you come back to work,”
This intervention, while potentially jarring, provided Robert with the necessary push to acknowledge the severity of his situation and seek professional help.
The manner in which this intervention was delivered was crucial. Rather than a punitive measure, it was framed as an act of support, offering assistance and expressing concern. This approach fostered a sense of permission, alleviating the burden of having to seek help independently.
“So it sounds like that felt less to you like a mandate and this is what you have to do if you want to keep your job and almost like permission,”
6. The Initial Steps Toward Recovery
Faced with the reality of his situation, Robert took the first crucial step: reaching out for help. He contacted Alcoholics Anonymous (AA), seeking immediate guidance on how to stop drinking.
“I remember coming home that afternoon after work and calling Alcoholics Anonymous and saying, I don’t feel good. I’m shaking. What do I do to stop drinking? What can I do?”
The initial response, a suggestion to attend AA meetings, was not the quick fix he had hoped for. This highlights a common misconception about recovery: the desire for an immediate solution, a magic pill to erase the problem. However, true recovery is a process that requires sustained effort and commitment.
Robert’s journey took a dramatic turn when he experienced a seizure, leading to hospitalization and subsequent admission to a 28-day treatment program at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester. This marked the beginning of a structured approach to recovery, providing him with the tools and support necessary to confront his addiction.
7. The Transformative Power of Community and Support
AA became a cornerstone of Robert’s early recovery, providing him with a vital sense of community and belonging.
“Um, a community, a safe space to share my story, to not feel judged, to be with people who understood where I was in my recovery process, where I’d been, what I’d hoped to do, and being with people also that had been in recovery for years and years and years, gave me hope that if they can do it, I can do it as well, too.,”
The shared experiences and non-judgmental atmosphere of AA meetings created a safe space for Robert to openly discuss his struggles and fears. The presence of individuals with long-term sobriety offered tangible proof that recovery was possible, instilling hope and motivation.
Beyond the fellowship of AA, family support played a crucial role in Robert’s journey. His father’s involvement in Al-Anon, a support group for families and friends of alcoholics, fostered a deeper connection and facilitated open communication about the challenges of addiction.
“He started going to Alanon as a way to support me. There was some alcoholism in his family. Actually, my mother’s family as well, too. But it really was a great way for us to connect and communicate and commune on what I was going through, which meant the world to me,”
This intergenerational dialogue helped break down the stigma surrounding addiction within the family, creating a more supportive and understanding environment.
8. Navigating Relapse: A Detour on the Road to Recovery
Recovery is rarely a linear progression. Setbacks and relapses are a common part of the journey. Robert experienced a significant relapse, a stark reminder of the persistent nature of addiction.
“It was a bad relapse and, I did a really stupid thing. I was in the hospital for about 5 days and thought. I’m done. I can go home now. I checked out against medical advice, headed to the liquor store, bought a ~bottle of~ bottle of vodka and tried to go back to where we were living. The locks had been changed, and the next thing I knew, the sheriff’s department was at the tail end of my car, and they pulled me over for an OWI. I spent a night in jail. And ended up, um, in treatment for 59 days,”
This relapse had serious consequences, including legal repercussions and an extended period in treatment and sober living.
The experience, while painful, provided valuable lessons. It reinforced the importance of adhering to the recovery process, utilizing support systems, and creating a safe environment free from triggers.
Robert’s time in a three-quarter house, a form of sober living, proved to be particularly transformative. Living alongside others in recovery fostered a sense of camaraderie and shared understanding, creating a supportive environment for navigating the challenges of early sobriety.
“Was probably the most humbling, but yet. Most incredible experience in my life, because when you talk about being with others who are like you at a, a, this was in a living situation,”
9. The Tools of Recovery: Building a Foundation for Lasting Sobriety
Treatment programs offer a comprehensive approach to recovery, equipping individuals with the tools and strategies necessary for lasting sobriety.
These programs go beyond simply stopping drinking; they address the underlying issues that contribute to addiction, such as emotional pain, trauma, or mental health conditions.
Robert emphasized the importance of this holistic approach:
“The treatment program touched on a lot of different aspects of recovery. It wasn’t just, hey, let’s stop drinking. . It was tools to help you stop drinking. It was ways to, Help break down this feeling of despair that I had, it and it also introduced back into my life. Some of the joys that I really. I’d let go of because I was actively drinking,”
Treatment provides a safe and supportive environment for individuals to explore their triggers, develop coping mechanisms, and rebuild their lives without alcohol.
10. Addressing the Doubts: Recovery is Possible
The prospect of recovery can seem daunting, both for those struggling with addiction and for their loved ones. The journey is often perceived as an overwhelming amount of work, and doubts about its attainability can creep in.
Robert acknowledges the validity of these concerns:
“You know, I’ve had to take a couple of swings at doing this, right? And it is work. And when you’re in the middle of it, and I think it’s probably whether you’re in the middle of anything that’s difficult, right? When I look back at those days, they were hard,”
However, he counters these doubts with a powerful message of hope and possibility. He emphasizes that the work of recovery, while challenging, ultimately leads to a life far richer and more fulfilling than one dominated by addiction.
“It’s given me a chance to live a life now that, I had really dreamt of back when I was pre drinking day,”
11. The Ongoing Journey: Recovery as a Lifelong Process
Recovery is not a destination but an ongoing journey. Robert’s story underscores the importance of continuous self-awareness, maintenance, and a willingness to seek support when needed.
“Someone that still goes to therapy. Someone who still thinks daily about the fact that I’m an alcoholic. It will never leave me. It’s part of my DNA,”
He continues to prioritize his mental health, attending therapy and utilizing coping mechanisms to manage anxiety and depression. This proactive approach is crucial for maintaining long-term sobriety and overall well-being.
Robert’s willingness to seek help when facing challenges is a testament to his commitment to recovery. He views these moments not as failures but as opportunities for growth and reinforcement of his sobriety.
“And so those tune ups are something that, um, you know, I’m not opposed to having to do. If I have to do it again in my life, I’m going to do it because I don’t see it as a failure or a weakness. I see it as I recognize the problem before it got really bad and did something. And I wasn’t ashamed about it,”
The Ripple Effect: Inspiring Hope and Reducing Stigma
Robert’s courage in sharing his story has a profound impact, extending beyond his personal journey. By openly discussing his struggles and triumphs, he contributes to a broader movement of reducing stigma and fostering hope.
Addiction is often shrouded in shame and secrecy, preventing individuals from seeking the help they need. By bringing his experience into the light, Robert helps to break down these barriers, encouraging others to step out of the shadows and pursue recovery.
“And that’s one of the things that ~ And that’s one of the things that I love,~ I love. Recovery stories and when we are able to share those stories, walking out of kinda the shadows and the shame of our experience of addiction, something so profound and amazing happens. Not in our own personal recovery journey, not just there, certainly yes. But for other people seeing those and hearing those stories and. I like to point back to the research. I’m like an, I love the evidence-based, you know, stuff out there. ~Uh, but~ the research does show that the more we share our stories, stigma is decreased and the more that stigma is decreased, more people feel like it’s okay to ask for help,”
A podcast dedicated to reducing the isolation and stigma of depression, one story at a time. Listen to our latest episode below, or search for “Giving Voice to Depression” wherever you listen to podcasts to access 400 other interviews in our archive.
